Ep. 263 It's Not a Disease! Common Tomato Fruit Problems You Can't Spray Away | #GoodGrowing

Welcome to the Good Growing podcast. I am Chris Enroth, horticulture educator with the University of Illinois Extension coming at you from MAcomb, Illinois, and we have got a great show for you today, tomato troubles. Are your love apples causing you problems, folks? Well, we are gonna be talking about that today, the tomato fruit disorders, things that are caused by the weather, stuff like that, not necessarily disease or insects. But you know I'm not doing this by myself.

I am joined as always every single week by horticulture educator Ken Johnson in Jacksonville. Hey, Ken.

Hello, Chris. Definitely seeing lots of issues in tomatoes, at least in the ones I'm growing this year.

As am I. I I kind of just sat in front of my tomatoes before recording this show for thirty minutes and just was, like, trying to, like, absorb all the information they can tell me. So I'll do my best today. Absorb all problems that they're showing me. I can relay that to everybody now.

So, yeah, I I I don't know. I guess Ken, do you grow tomatoes every single year? I think we've talked about this before, but remind me. Are you a tomato grower?

At the home at our home, we did not plant any tomato plants. We do have some volunteers coming up, but we don't eat a lot of tomatoes. I'm not like, I'll eat a tomato occasionally, but we don't eat. We used to make a lot of sauce and stuff, but, we don't really do that anymore. So now I'm not a big tomato grower at home.

Tomatoes are kind of divas or divos. You want the milk version of that. I don't know. To me, you know, if we had limited time and space to garden and tomatoes always seem to have lots of problems that I don't wanna deal with. So I just don't grow my own.

We've got some at our extension garden. So that's that's what I'm judging my I guess my the issues I'm seeing is what we're having the problems we're having out there with our tomatoes.

Okay. Okay. Well, I and I'm I'm I'm half in that boat. I always want a homegrown tomato every summer. I just like want one one of them.

And then once I get my one, I'm usually good. I don't know. We've always talked about do we ever wanna, like, can or freeze tomatoes? Well, that's gonna involve growing a lot more. You know, we we only have right now four tomato plants in our yard, and that's plenty for us.

We don't need anymore. You can probably get by with, one, maybe two. So so yeah. But with all of our extension supported gardens, our food donation gardens, demonstration gardens, I mean, tomato is a popular plant. I was we was reading earlier today, it's like the third most popular crop grown in The United States commercially.

You know, there's other vegetable crops grown that are more a little bit more popular, but tomato is a big one for The USA. So it's something that we have a lot in our extension supported gardens. So, yeah, that's where I see a lot of the issues myself.

Yeah. But I think it's, I guess, still the most popular home garden much still to go.

I

I

think a

lot of people feel almost if you have a garden, sometimes you almost feel obligated to grow them. And I finally gotten to the point where I don't feel obligated to grow them. So

You've reached the new plateau. A new higher level of gardening. Yes.

Reached enlightenment.

There you go. Tomato enlightenment. I like that. Now he only grows tomatillos. Yeah.

Oh my goodness. Well well, Ken, I guess you had a a friend on your tomatoes. Right? And and you brought a little show and tell for us. So, do do you have a late season problem in hand?

Yes. So this one this tomato's got all kinds of problems. So on this one, for people who can't see what I'm showing, we've got a little hole in the side. So this is a tomato fruitworm, also known as probably more commonly known as corn earworm. So this is caterpillar.

They'll crawl into your eat into your tomatoes. You'll get all kinds of you cut it open, Sometimes there's still a caterpillar and there'll be frass and decay and stuff in there. Not a good deal when you cut that open, but that's pretty I think later in the year, we start seeing that more and more on our tomato plants. And then, so I guess to get away from the biotic stuff. Fruit cracking.

So again, this tomato I'm showing here, we have got some giant cracks at the top of it. This they happened a little bit earlier, they're kind of scabbed over. Looks pretty ugly. If I were to eat this, this has been sitting for about a week now, so it's getting a little mushy. I'm not going to eat this one or donate it for that matter.

But it's kinda scabbed over. You know, something this big, you're you could still eat this. It doesn't look like there's any kind of decay or or any decay pathogens or anything like that in there. So could potentially cut that out, but you'd be cutting out a lot of the tomato because it's like it's almost like the Grand Canyon on the top of this tomato here.

Yes. It is. Some serious cracks in that tomato, everyone. Oh my goodness. So I guess let's dive into it.

I mean, you you just showed us our first kind of physiological disorder here, that that cracking of that skin. Now when I say physiological, what am I really talking about here, Ken? What like a versus that that worm that you're showing us. Not a worm. Correct me, Ken.

A caterpillar.

The worm in your tomato.

That's right. Yep. Yeah.

So like our physiological this would be like our nonliving. So it would be stuff that's not a fungus, bacteria, insect, wildlife, what have you. So it's usually gonna be some combination of weather related, soil related, soil fertility related. So it is the kind of nonliving stuff causing problems for us.

Mhmm. It could even be like an imbalance of soil nutrients. Like, someone who overdoes it with one nutrient. Now the ratios are off and the plant's kinda out of whack. So, yeah, you your soil balance of nutrients.

And and so, yeah, I guess, you know, right off the bat, we could always just say, a soil test, and that will help that will help you a lot so that you know more about what might be needed and what you have too much of. I do see a lot of soil tests where it's like, you really don't need anything. And if it and and and and when we look at the results, you got too much, like, phosphorus or you got too much this. Like, it's it's it's to the excessive point where you're harming the plant. So that hole I'm gonna put ten ten ten twenty twenty twenty on my garden multiple times a year, every single year, doing a soil test would help to know if any of that's limited and if you really need that because especially something like phosphorus and and maybe even potassium, you can build up levels that are going to inhibit the uptake of other nutrients for your plants.

And we've definitely seen that with lawns and landscapes because people put a lot of fertilizer on lawns and all that phosphorus builds up and suddenly, well, all of your broadleaf plants can't take up any of the the micronutrient metals that they need like zinc and iron. So soil test. Alright. I'm gonna get off that soapbox. I'm stepping down.

Yes. So so for cracking. Mhmm. So in this tomato, we've got, you know, the big furrows at starting at the top where it attaches to the the plants at the stem end. Sometimes you'll get something called rain check, which is small cracks, usually kind of concentric around the top of the the tomato fruit, see it in peppers, as well.

I always see it in in our jalapenos. And usually we're getting this because, it's a water issue. A lot of times it's happening when it gets kind of dry. And here in Jacksonville, up until this week or last week when people are listening to this, it got very dry. I was getting cracks, in our yard even under mulch.

It was dry. Didn't have a lot much soil moisture at least at the top of the soil. So it's getting really dry. Then you go in and irrigate heavily or you get rain. All of a sudden, the the plant takes up all kinds of water, pumps that into the fruit, and the fruit can't expand quick enough and it will crack.

Basically, you have that much so much pressure build up the fruit crack. So that's typically what's causing your fruit cracking is just, again, that kinda inconsistent watering. Get dry, plenty of water. It can't handle it, and it cracks. So it may the the way to kind of rectify that is just make sure you have consistent watering.

Again, mulch can help retain some of that, but even if it gets, you know, real dry, applying water, so that you're not getting this big influx and causing your fruit to to crack.

Yeah. You might hear a lot of mulch talk today. So Yeah. So It's helpful with tomatoes. Yeah.

I I we definitely are we're seeing a lot of, like, that that splittings, that fruit cracking on our tomatoes right now, especially as as Ken and I speak, we're we're in the after effects of what you said five inches of rain came down a day or two ago. Same thing in Macomb. We got a lot of rain here as well, well over five inches. And so we're I think for the last week, we're, yeah, probably under 10 inches, but but a lot. We've we've received a lot of rain.

When I go out to our little food donation garden we here we have here at at the office, yes, we have lots of split tomatoes. And, you know, especially if you get them right off the bat, though, Ken, I I don't even mind eating when they're initially split, like, the day of. But once you have some time, things like bacteria, fungi, they can set into there. They can cause other rot issues. So you just wanna cut those part portions off as Ken was mentioning when he was demonstrating with the tomato we had.

Even though you'd have to cut off Ken's tomato, like, you'd have a third of a fruit left maybe. Yeah. If you're lucky. If you're a fourth maybe. Oh, goodness.

Yeah. So yeah. Mulch, that's the big one that I I do a lot. And then, you know, we do drip irrigation at our extension gardens at home. I'm just trying to keep an eye on that soil moisture.

And if I see the plant sort of start to wilt, then I know I'm probably gonna get fruit cracking. It's too late. I should have been on top of the water. So just something to be mindful of.

Yeah. At home, like a soaker hose. I think that that's a little easier to to do it at home than, like, drip irrigation because you can that's little easier to move around. Yeah. So you can just, you know, move your soaker hose around the garden, turn it on for half hour or hour at a time depending on how quickly it's coming out and and get your wandering that way.

Well, our our next one here, Ken, this is one I do see at least multiple times a year, you know, maybe a handful of times, and that's yellow shoulder. And so it's like all of the tomato develops and ripens except the top. And they call that, like, yellow shoulders. Now when looking at something like this, doesn't it seem odd that it's, like, the part that's exposed to the most sunlight and the most heat is the thing not developing right there? So could it be perhaps that there is a temperature threshold where ripening occurs and then one where it stops?

Is that the cause of yellow shoulder? Yes.

So, yeah, usually, it's because you've got it it's too hot. So, basically, when you get temperatures above 85, 90 degrees, that red coloring, the lycopene doesn't develop in the fruits, which in the case of yellow shoulder, you know, the top of that fruit is is typically what's going to be exposed to the sun. So it's heating up more than the rest of the fruit, and you're not getting that that proper coloring, in there leading to that that yellow ink. Another potential reason this can happen is low potassium levels in the soil or low organic matters, high pH. So there's there's some potential soil fertility issues that can cause us to.

I'd say more often than not, though it's probably in a home garden anyway, probably more often heat. But, again, soil testing can help eliminate that as a potential problem potentially for you. Okay.

And and I think this is related. White core where and it it happens kind of at the so, like, when I'm cutting open a tomato, it's like I get this white, corky, hard texture kinda right underneath the calyx where the the fruit connects to the plant. A lot of times, it originates there, but there's sometimes the heck, the whole fruit interior of the fruit has this white, like, corky texture to it. And I think that, again, also, like, kind of the yellow shoulder sort of related to heat. Right?

It's just like the darn fruit gets so hot. I think we're I was reading this old Illinois Extension publication and said that, you know, when a when a tomato fruit gets exposed to the sunlight, like full blazing sunshine, the internal temperature of that fruit can get up over a 122 degrees Fahrenheit. I think that's what they measured it as. So forget about hot potato. Let's play hot tomato.

And and so, yeah, I I think we have a lot of issues that can develop, especially when that fruit just gets exposed to hot, high temperatures, lots of sunlight. And I know we're not talking about disease today, but this does happen sometimes, especially when we get in, like, a a leaf foliar disease and we lose the leaves of our plants that then exposes our fruit to more sun than what we were than what it was exposed to before. And I think that's when we can get some of these things like yellow shoulder, white core, the actual fruit themselves will we call it sunburn. And and so you just your your your fruit winds up just being overexposed to sunlight, and it's sunburns.

So for white core, I think potassium excess of nitrogen can also play a role in that. So, again, soil test, not that you're gonna get nitrogen from your soil test, but don't go too, don't get too heavy handed when you're putting your fertilizer down in the spring for that stuff too.

Yep. That's true. We always get the question of, hey. I got this beautiful bushy tomato plant, but no tomatoes. Well, you might have gone a little too heavy handed on the nitrogen.

Well, in this next one, I mean, this is, like, the one. It's like you get these beautiful clusters of tomatoes start to develop. You're gonna make a sauce out of these beautiful San Marzanos aromas that you have coming on. And then as it starts to ripen or maybe even it's still a little green, you see these black spot develop at the bottom end of the fruit, the blossom end of the fruit. And then it gets worse and worse and worse.

What's happening, Ken? What is what is occurring to the blossom end of this particular tomato?

Yes. So we've got blossom end rot here, and and this is one I I think a lot of people, especially adding new gardeners, they think this is a disease. I mean, because when you look at it, it looks like you've got some kind of, pathogen, some kind of fungus or something causing the spot on your tomato. But this is an abiotic again, abiotic issue, like everything else we're talking about today. Traditionally, you know, we talk about it as low calcium levels in the fruits.

I've read some stuff where that may or may not be because sometimes they found sufficient calcium levels in the fruit and the fruit can still develop blossom and rot. I think more and more you're seeing people just call it abiotic stress. But calcium can potentially play a role as well though. So basically your fruit's stressed and with this again, it's usually that inconsistent watering. So if calcium is the issue that's taken up in the water stream, if you don't have enough water getting into that fruit, you're not getting calcium there, that leads to the breakdown of, you know, cell walls and stuff and you get this rotting at the end of the fruit.

So whether it's calcium, whether it's stress, it's basically again inconsistent watering. So making sure you've got that consistent water, inch or so of water a week ideally. You know, if it's really hot, maybe one little more on there depending on, you know, how how big your plants are and stuff. So making sure that, again, that mulch help retain that moisture in the soil and all this stuff we talked about with fruit cracking. It's probably gonna help with blossom end rot.

And and there are just some some plants are more prone to blossom end rot than others. You know, our large, fruited, tomatoes, like paste tomatoes, you see it quite a bit. I've never seen it in a cherry tomato. So I I think usually your smaller ones are gonna be less prone to it. I don't know if I'd wanna make a a sauce out of cherry tomatoes, but, you know, I guess you could do it if you had the patience.

Yeah. A lot of patience. So I I think if some people have abandoned the notion of growing paste tomatoes because of blossom end rot, look for what are they called? The ox heart tomatoes. They're they they're not like they're not like paste tomatoes in terms of, like, they have a little bit more kind of moisture in them, but they're not like slicing tomatoes either.

So they have less moisture than those. So so look into that as maybe a possibility. If you've abandoned completely a lot of your paste growing tomatoes, those ox hearts, are kinda meaty.

Yeah. And they're I did come across some some that have lower incidence of loss of mineral. I'm not sure what you know, these are all slicing or paste. But, like, celebrity, fresh pack, which sounds like one more antenna for commercial production, Jetstar, Mountain Pride, Pick Red, which probably another commercial one. Sunny in winter are some that are that kind of been listed out there across the Internet as ones that are a little less prone to developing Boston Manor if that's something you consistently have problems with.

But, again, kinda look at your watering practices, and that may help those problems. Do and you can do do a soil test to make sure calcium isn't gonna be the issue. Make sure you do have sufficient calcium in your soils. And, like, in in, like, your your potassium and calcium, you know, if if you get too much of one, that's gonna affect the uptake of the other. So you kinda gotta, I'll say, the fine line there, but, again, you can't get too heavy handed with one and not potentially have problems with the other.

I always hear like, people say, well, I I threw the eggshells in the hole, or I put crushed up Tums and threw it in the hole, and, man, my tomatoes look better. But I always figured, well, if you're you're just paying closer attention. So you're probably watering more. You're probably treating your plant a little bit better this year than last year when it was not expected and you didn't know it was about to happen. So Yeah.

You need your placebo.

That's what I think. Anyway well, Ken, this next one, this has been, like, numero uno for the year 2026 of tomato problems. And it's just it's the problem of nothing. Nothing's happening. Nothing's ripening.

The plants are sitting there. Why aren't they ripening? And and so I guess, first things first, why aren't they ripening? But do we need to maybe go back a little bit further into, like, why you don't get pollination or, like, why you don't have fruit in general? Like, because that has also been another common question too.

Like, you know, the plant seems to just not be doing anything. I see flowers, but then the flowers fall off or there's no fruit. So what's going on, do you think?

Yeah. So so both of these kinda go, I don't say hand in hand, but they're gonna have similar reasons. So with, no fruit so maybe take a step back. So for tomatoes, they have perfect flowers. They have both male and female parts on the same flower.

And they can self pollinate. So you don't need necessarily have to have cross pollination. You do have to have movement in that flower in order for it to release its pollen. So a lot times, it's something like a bumblebee. They'll they'll vibrate that, release its pollen.

You get enough wind airflow through there, you know, it'll release some pollen. So, you know, I don't think usually insect pollen pollinators not being around it usually isn't gonna be a problem. What what can be an issue though is that or temperatures. So if we have night temperatures is really kind of the big one. If we have high night temperature that was over 70, mid seventies, I think, temperatures at night are above the mid seventies, that can inhibit the formation of pollen.

It could also inhibit the pollen fertilizing the the eggs or the ovaries, and stuff. So high night temperatures, you know, hot day temperatures, temperatures over 85 degrees, consistently with those warm night temperatures, can cause that cause flowers to drop, as well. So we've had some pretty humid days, which helps keep that night temperature high because it's gonna hold on to more of that heat. So I think that probably a lot of that, if you've got a gap or you're not getting any tomatoes produced by your plants, I think this year, I think one of the reasons that's probably just because it's been hot at night and it's causing those flowers to drop or the the pollen is not, being developed properly. And then with high humidities or high humidity that can cause, I think basic humidity over 70%, which we've had plenty of that.

We've had days 80 plus percent humidity, a good chunk of the day and even into the night, that can cause that pollen to clump and not fall properly or not being fertilized properly. So you've got that additional high humidity causing the issues with the pollen. So high temperatures, high humidity gonna cause problems with pollination. And on on the flip side, you know, looking down the road a month or two, you know, low night temperatures below 55 degrees can cause flowers to drop. So, you know, we've we've kind of got that Goldilocks zone for tomatoes, you know, in that sixties, seventies time per window there where they really like to to grow and develop.

And so I I definitely think we've seen a lot of those development issues, and it looks like July for 2026 went down as one of the hottest months on record this year. So and and a lot of that that average happens though too. As you mentioned, Ken, it's those nighttime temperatures. Yeah. It can get hot during the day.

Yeah. That can impact the the development of your your pollination, your fruit development, ripening. But, boy, when those nighttime temperatures stay above 75 degrees, that is tough on plants, all plants, and people too, I'll add. And the electrical bill says that air conditioner is just running nonstop. So, yeah, the the humidity has been pretty brutal.

I do recall I think it was one day. It was, like, 88 degrees and 88% humidity, and I'm like, shouldn't it be raining right now? Isn't that like a a natural law? Like, when these two temperature and humidity meet, it rains. It definitely wasn't.

It just felt like you're walking through rain. So, yeah, it it we've definitely had some issues with our kinda temperature related. So what can we do in that regard? I mean, we can't control the weather, the nighttime temperatures, weather. You know, I I think one of the things that that does help I mean, it's kinda the sort of basic tenant of tomato culture is staking and trellising.

Get them off the ground, good airflow. It can help a little bit. And shade cloth. I don't know if anyone would wanna put shade cloth over their vegetable garden, but, I mean, that's something they do in Arizona. I don't know if we wanna start doing that in Illinois, but it seems like it might be a viable option anymore.

Yeah. We like the the ginger project we've been doing. You know, we we've got those under with 30% shake off, and there is a noticeable difference when you walk into those tunnels with that shake off on. It's mean, shade cloth isn't cheap. And if you've got you know, if it was me and I only had one tomato plant, I wouldn't do it.

But if I had, you know, a good amount of time and, you know, I've talked to people, they have fifty, sixty tomato plants. I mean, I'd maybe something I would think about if I've got that many plants doing that.

Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense then. Yeah. Yeah.

If you're a a really avid hobbyist or you're you're selling these, then, yeah, shade cloth might make sense. So but then you have to find that balance. That's kinda what we're thinking about with the ginger project is, like, 30%. Is that good? Can we go higher to 50%?

Like, how what's the what amount of shade can you provide without losing your your yield? Because these plants do need sunlight for photosynthesis and and for for a good yield harvest. So, yeah, that's, like, the good question to answer for ginger that we're at least puzzled about or puzzling. Yeah. Mulch, as we said, is is very popular topic these days with tomatoes.

Mulching helps with that soil insulation. We mentioned staking. Yeah. We and we talked about especially with blossom mineral, we talked about was picking, like, more resistant varieties out there. I don't know if there's anything else we can hit about things that we can maybe help alleviate some of the issues with lack of ripening or lack of fruit development.

Yeah. And it's one of those things that you're just you're kinda at the mercy of the weather. And with that, you know, the fruit ripening, we talked about that with yellow shoulder, basically. Temperature's above the mid eighties. You don't get that red color being produced.

So, again, there's not much you do that short of picking that and bringing it inside. When it starts to color up, pick it, ripen it inside if you wanna get that full coloration on it. I will say sometimes with a fruit that doesn't ripen, there are cultivars out there that stay green or yellow. So it doesn't usually happen, but some like, in there. Just make sure you you know, if you're expecting it to turn red, make sure it's actually supposed to turn red, and it's not supposed to stay orange or green or yellow or green.

So

Yep. I I just sit down the garden looking at the tomato plant. Why won't you turn? Well, it did. You just gotta you gotta, like, feel it.

You gotta just it goes from, like, the, like, more stiff skin to a little bit of give when you push it with, like, your thumb or, yeah, you give it a little squeeze. And then you taste it. I always say, like, there's so many tomatoes out there that if you taste it and it tastes bad, just chalk it up to that's just a gross variety and grow something different next year. Try something different. I think there's a few as we we're we're getting into kind of the end of the year for our tomato plants.

It's endgame time for tomato growers. There's some maintenance things out there that I think would be interesting to talk about. And this first one here is I I've I've never done it before. I don't know. It if you have either, but topping a tomato plant, why would you wanna cut off your tomato plant?

Top it. We tell them not to top trees. Why are we saying top your tomatoes?

Yeah. This is not something I've done either. But basically, you'd wanna if you're topping your tomatoes, you go out, top it, and that's instead of putting energy into producing more leaves and branches and stuff like that or or more fruit and flowers, it's gonna put its energy into kind of finishing off, so to speak, the fruit that's already developed. So typically you do this six to eight weeks before your expected frost, first frost, because in general it takes about six to eight weeks from a tomato to go from a flower to something you're going to pick. So you do that, everything's then focused on fruit production, which can help kind of, you know, sometimes end of the year we end up with the issue of, I've got all these tomatoes, what am going to do with them?

Frost is coming and they're not ready yet. So you kind eliminate everything that's gonna be getting ready late when you're gonna have a frost, and you can and get that stuff that's on there ripened, hopefully in time before the frost comes.

Well, that's more extreme than I've ever I was like, I'll pluck off flowers, or I'll I'll remove, like, smaller green fruits that I know just won't have time. But this is, like, getting the the out.

Yeah. I think

for cut.

If we're already usually, you do it, like, down to the fruit cluster or, a a branch or something. Basically, you're taking the top off. And, yeah, the alternative would be, yeah, just go pick stuff off. But I think with topping, it's you're kinda one and done and whereas the other stuff, you're it's still gonna be putting energy into producing new branches and stuff. So maybe maybe get side by side comparison.

Yeah. Maybe we'll grow tomatoes next year and try.

There you go. Yeah. See what happens. That'd be that'd be cool. That's that's a good experiment.

Another experiment to add to the garden. Well, this episode's coming out, what, September? Not September. Oh, don't say that. Almost September, but August 28.

So if my average first frost date's October 15, which the last couple of years, we've been more towards November, I probably wanna do that pretty soon. Like, listen to this episode on August 28 and maybe go out and top my tomatoes even though it might still be hot. It might still feel like summer, but I have to make that sacrifice. I'll give it I I'm gonna give it a try this year because I know I'm gonna have a couple fruit clusters. They're gonna be at that point where it's like, okay.

If you just had the resources dedicated from the root system, maybe, just maybe, you could make it before that frost.

I need another week or two. Story of my life.

Always. If only there was another week or month in the year that could help me out a lot. So I'm I'm trying to top my tomatoes this year. I'm gonna do it.

So another thing, you know, we're kind of on that same line. It's, you know, we've got a frost coming. Usually, hear from me, you know, I've got all these tomatoes on my plant. What do I do? Basically at that point, you know, the frost is imminent.

Pick the fridge can, bring it inside, ripen it, you know. So basically when tomatoes are developing, they're going to grow, continue growing and they'll get kind of their full size and then they're going to start to ripen, to change color. So basically you want those full size fruit, that's stuff you can ripen indoors. If it's not fully developed, you can bring it in. It's probably not going to color up all that well.

So you can try. That's, you know, it's gonna take up counter space. But, you know, alternatively, you know, you get, you know, fried green tomatoes. There you go. People like them, I don't think I've ever eaten them, but it's a thing.

So

Oh, I have. I we we watched the movie fried green tomatoes when I was a kid, and my mom made those, like, that that night. She, like, went out to the garden, picked some green tomatoes, and fried them up. It was kinda like eggplant fried eggplant, I think. It was it was alright.

Have you ever done a side by side comparison of when you put a tomato on the window shelf versus putting in a paper bag with, an apple? Does it go any faster?

I am not I don't usually bring them in because usually at that point, I'm done with tomatoes, I don't really care. Sick of them.

Isn't that the truth? You're like, we're giving people late season advice, and they're like, please. I'm sick of them by the time September rolls around and ready to stop gardening right now. But I am looking forward to some cool season crops. So the fall stuff.

I I'm I'm gonna get some turnips in the ground, spinach, carrots. Those are those are fun. So but that's a different show. Yeah. Well, Ken, the end of the year is as you're sick and tired of gardening, there's usually still the last task of cleanup.

Now I think this is pretty important. I I do usually wait for the first kinda hard frost to hit before I I really start pulling things out of the garden, but I do pull things out of the garden. I think it's critical. And if you haven't marked it down already, like, either take a picture with your phone, write it down in a notebook where everything was. Because you know what?

I do not remember the next year. Like, did I have tomatoes here? I don't remember. But why do we clean up the garden? Like, what's the the purpose for garden cleanup at the end of the year?

Yeah. So I think, you know, more and more, we talk about kind of landscapes in general. I think we're getting away from or maybe encouraging people not to do a lot of cleanup in the fall. I would say the the exception to that would be your vegetable or fruit areas because this is where your the things we didn't talk about today, all your diseases, potentially insects are going to overwinter. You know, lot of our foliar leaf diseases, the Septoria, early blight, things like that, that overwinters on plant material.

So if you leave your tomatoes out, you don't do a good job cleaning that up. You get as much of that stuff out as you can. You've got those pathogens in your soil in the in your garden when you put your plants out next year. So the more you can clean up and get that out of your garden, reduce that overwintering area, can help reduce, a lot of those problems we're potentially gonna have from those diseases, you know, from those insects. So that is one thing that I always try to make sure I do.

If I don't get it right away, you know, it's sometime during the winter, real early spring, so I can get as much of that stuff out of there as I can. So try to dentist are gonna eliminate your problem, but you're gonna help reduce the chances of some of those problems developing.

I'd stress, you know, if you can get that root system out of the ground too, because a lot of those pathogens will move from the stem down into the roots. And that's a really great spot if you're trying to eke out existence during the winter to be underground attached to a dead root system. So, and then they can survive in the soil for years and years once they they get there. So, yeah, try to get those roots out of the ground if at all possible. And you're not gonna be able to get them all out.

I understand that. But as you know, at least rip up that plant. Do what you can.

Yeah. Something's better than nothing.

That's right. Yeah. Do we and if we have diseases, do we just throw those in the compost pile in our plants plant disease plants?

I mean, you can. Probably not a good idea unless you're getting your your compost nice and hot. Usually, I I would say for the most part, people are not getting their backyard compost hot enough to kill pathogens. So stick in the yard waste, You know, big enough yard, bury it. So eight foot deep.

Mhmm.

Not not just, like, put it on the ground and dump some soil on it. Actually, dig a hole and bury it. Yep. I think so.

If you're doing a fall weenie roast, just dump all your tomate dead tomato plants on the fire. Hopefully, they're dry. Watch your fire go out. No. You do if you can burn them, burn them.

But the I I hear that recommendation a lot, and especially when I just tell people, get as many roots as you can. You're gonna have a bunch of soil on there too. You throw all that onto a fire, I can just see that all going out or just being a nasty smoky mess. So Yes. But, yeah, you can burn them too if you

can keep that fire going. And you're allowed to depending on where you live.

Oh, that's right. That's right. I I am so spoiled in that I the county's in my backyard, so I can just cross over to the county and burn whatever I want. It's not true. I don't burn tires or anything, but that was a lot of great information about those physiological, or those kind of, tomato fruit disorders, that we encountered late in the season and then kind of the sort of late season maintenance ideas of topping to plants, which I I will try.

And whenever frost is coming I mean, we just heard Ken has abandoned his garden. He's done with it. So we're not saving any green tomatoes. But then if you're not gonna do that, at least clean up the garden. So a lot of great information all that today.

The Good Growing podcast production of University of Illinois Extension edited this week by me, Chris Enroth. Hey, Ken. Thanks for hanging out today and chatting all about tomatoes. We missed Emily, of course, but she'll be back next week.

Yes. Thank you, Chris. And I guess you had to just remember, control what you can control. Make sure you water, do your soil test, and that can solve a lot of problems for you, hopefully. Or at least help you figure out what's what's wrong.

And let's do this again next week.

Oh, we shall do this again next week. We're going to be talking about goldenrod. That's one of my favorite paper colors. And it's it is a one of my favorite crayon colors too. It was always the shortest one in my box growing up.

But anyway, we're gonna be talking goldenrod, the plant. Not just the plant, the genus of plants, a group of plants known as goldenrod. That'll be a fun show. Well, listeners, thank you for doing what you do best and that is listening or if you watched us on YouTube watching. And as always, keep on growing.

University of Illinois Extension.

Was not expecting the, favorite paper there.

It is my favorite paper color. We have this, like, wall of paper colors at the office, and I'm I can choose it, I pick goldenrod as my handout color. I love it.